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The Conference Board Presentation: The 5 Truths About Transforming Your Talent Strategy and Driving Culture Change for Inclusion


There has been a seismic shift in how people view work and what they want from their employer, which has created the biggest talent crisis for organizations in recent history. People want to work in an environment that prioritizes equity and inclusivity, and when that’s not the case, they’re moving on to organizations where they feel valued and have a sense of belonging. So how can companies revamp their talent strategy to meet the demands of current and prospective employees? 

In this session at The Conference Board, we shared the five key focus areas for recruiting and retaining top talent. Watch below to learn more:


This transcript was automatically generated with artificial intelligence. It’s in the queue to go through a review with human eyes!

00:00:00:00 – 00:00:26:02

Appreciate it, everybody. We’re gathering back together. I can feel the energy and the excitement after that panel. Such great topics.

00:00:26:03 – 00:00:49:00

That’s great. Thanks for coming back after that quick break. As we just saw in that panel, those of us in change in organization design think a lot about culture and change and mindset change in lots of different contexts, but certainly one that’s really important and near and dear to our hearts is and it’s essential is creating a culture of inclusion.

00:00:49:00 – 00:01:15:01

And so in this session, we’re joined by Chris Thornton and David Oppong. Chris is the host of Change at Work podcast and senior principal at the Bartering Group, and Daniel is the founder of the Courage Collective, A D and AI training and consulting firm for the modern workplace. They’re going to share now how to drive culture change that embeds diversity, equity and inclusion into all aspects of the employee journey.

00:01:15:01 – 00:01:23:00

So please join me in welcoming Chris and Daniel. So much.

00:01:23:01 – 00:01:43:02
Everyone, I’m Chris. Hello, folks. Daniel, Everyone here. Nice to meet you. So we’re going to try to as interactive as possible. I know that sounds ridiculous in a group this size, but let’s try to make it somewhat interactive. If you don’t like something that I’m saying, like you adamantly disagree with it, like shout it out. It’s okay. Used to be a high school teacher.

00:01:43:02 – 00:02:07:03

I can take it. Please don’t do that to Daniel unless he encourages you to do that. Okay? Don’t do that to him. You can do that to me. We’re going to talk about five truths about transforming your talent strategy and driving culture change for inclusion. We’re going to give you five tips and things to consider. So you’re going to walk away with some things to go look at and consider When it comes to what are you doing from talent strategy?

00:02:07:03 – 00:02:26:07

We’re going to focus in on the EVP. We’re going to focus in on benefits. We’re going to focus in on leaders at all levels. That’s where this is going. Good. All right. Let’s go on to the next slide, if you could. If you have if you have a podcast app, go ahead and open that up. I don’t mind multitasking.

00:02:26:07 – 00:02:43:03

If you’re subscribing to the podcast of change at work, strongly encourage you to do that. In fact, Daniel was a guest on the podcast with me and give it to us. And yeah, it’s definitely worth a look. If you’re going to listen to one, listen to that one. Daniel Do you want to talk about the Purge Collective? Yeah, let’s see.

00:02:43:03 – 00:03:03:13

So the Courage Collective is a diversity equity and inclusion consulting firm. We take a strategic, holistic and human centered approach to the work. I think for me what that means is looking at the whole employee experience and thinking about how are we creating workplaces that are great for people? We know that people bring a collection of unique identities into the workplace.

00:03:03:14 – 00:03:22:12

We’re trying to foster a culture of inclusion. We have to do that with the unique needs of individuals in mind. And so we’ve been able to work with large organizations and all the way down to ten person startups. And one of the common themes is people are trying to figure out how do we create a compelling and unique culture that really values the employee experience?

00:03:22:12 – 00:03:48:08

And that’s the work we get to help companies do, both on the consulting front as well as training and development. That’s great. We have partnered at Daggerwing with the Courage Collective, and I’ve sat in many sessions with Daniel. He has helped move our culture forward and have introduced him to several of our clients and everybody loves what the Courage Collective does and Daniel in particular.

00:03:48:11 – 00:04:06:05

So let’s talk a little bit about Daggerwing. We’re one of the sponsors of this event. We’re a change consultancy. We focus in on the people side of change. That’s not unique except the way that we do it and the way that we focus in on people may be a little bit different. I’ve already talked to one person who said I have absolutely never heard of Daggerwing Group.

00:04:06:05 – 00:04:30:05

What’s wrong with your name and you didn’t say that. You didn’t say that. You didn’t say, We’ve been around, Where have you been? And I said, We’ve been right here working with a whole lot of clients and helping them move forward. Clients include Pfizer, and that’s like aviation tequila all across the board. That’s who we are. What makes us a little bit different is that we focus in on doing change, right?

00:04:30:05 – 00:04:47:03

The first time is nothing worse than doing change and then going, no, no, no, that wasn’t right. Let’s go back and do it again. No, not quite right. Let’s do it again. So we focus in on doing it right the first time. And the way that we do that is often through some really difficult truths, which we’re going to get to in this presentation.

00:04:47:04 – 00:05:33:00

We are experiencing a global seismic shift in how people feel about work. Great revolutionary, right? If that’s your one, take away. I’m so sorry you’ve not been paying attention for the last two and a half years. Life is really, really hard right now, period, for many people. Not for you. Congratulations. You are one of the very lucky few where life is really, really hard and life can range all kinds of up from from personal to professional to health, to finance to where am I going to live because I can’t afford a house now to what’s going on in the outside world.

00:05:33:02 – 00:05:49:14

You saw some of the stats from our presenter earlier, and this is this comes from the same Microsoft report that you got to hear from. So we know the stats at 41% of the global workforce is considering resigning from their current roles. 36% of people who quit in the past six months did so without having a new job.

00:05:50:01 – 00:06:18:08

So something’s weird. Something’s really weird right now. The way we think about it, it’s not exact. It’s not like this hierarchy literally got turned on its head. But, you know, when the Kardashians shake a salad, some of you do, and some of you don’t. You never want to think about people’s needs. And it just got all shook up.

00:06:18:09 – 00:06:42:13

But what that means for us is professionals is you can’t rely on your past assumptions, your past experiences to go, I know how to solve this. I totally got this. We solved it five years ago by doing X or my previous employee employer. We did it this way and it really, really worked. What we’re asking you to do is challenge every assumption about how you used to do things and go, Is there a different way?

00:06:42:13 – 00:07:07:09

Do I need to solve the challenges that I’m facing in a different way? We think the answer sometimes is yes. Not always, but sometimes the answer is yes, that you’ve got to challenge yourself to look at the problems that you’re facing and going, What don’t I know about what I’m seeing and getting really, really curious about what you don’t know?

00:07:07:11 – 00:07:34:09

Confirmation bias right now is your enemy. I am prone to hyperbole, but that one, I’m going to stick by, I think, confirmation bias right now. Of course, in. I know how to do that. I got that. I got challenge yourself to say what don’t I know about the situation that I’m facing as we go on to the next slide?

00:07:34:10 – 00:07:50:06

So when we think about some of the changes that have happened, we have to look no further than equity, inclusion and belonging. When we think about this specifically as the way the world has changed, think about 2020, right? The way that the pandemic brought the world to a pause in a way that few things have in recent history.

00:07:50:10 – 00:08:13:06

We also have to think about the murder of George Floyd and how that catalyzed a racial reckoning like few we’ve seen ever. Right. And so how did that impact the employee experience? Well, people are like, well, what does my employer say about these things? They want to work at places that align with their values. They want to be in a place where they feel seen, known, heard, valued, accepted, celebrated.

00:08:13:06 – 00:08:36:14

Right. How does that translate to the employee experience? What it comes with pushing inclusion and belonging to the forefront, 60% 67% of jobs seekers want to work in a workforce that is diverse. 50% want the their employers to increase their inclusion and belonging efforts. Now, when we look at underrepresented groups or historically excluded groups, that number goes up exponentially.

00:08:37:01 – 00:08:52:11

And then we have to think about Gen Z again. That number goes up exponentially. They’re looking for companies that align with their values in that care about what they care about. So we think about the shift in work, right? We think about the things that people are looking for when they go to work. Attitudes about work are changing.

00:08:52:14 – 00:09:08:04

Is my company care about me? Do I get mental health days? Do I get a break? Like, can I take a break or do I have to be on all the time? Think about the attitudes toward work and then think about with the pandemic hybrid workforce. I even dressed up for y’all. I didn’t put on my sweats. Right.

00:09:08:07 – 00:09:27:06

But like that, the way that some people work, I’m not going back in the office. I can’t do another. Like, I’m not going to get dressed up and come, you know, like 50 minutes every day there and back. I’m not going to do that right the way that we think about work is changing, but have attitudes, employers, attitudes toward work, have they have they evolved as well?

00:09:27:08 – 00:09:51:06

Well, one of the things that we’re seeing is that executives are thinking and talking about this exponentially greater than they used to in the past. S&P 500 CEOs talk about these issues during earnings calls that increase by 658% since 2018. So what does that mean? It’s never been more important to embed equity, inclusion and belonging into the employee journey.

00:09:51:08 – 00:10:17:08

Why does that matter? So most companies, when they think about diversity, equity and inclusion, think about two things. Can you guess what one of those two things are? Two primary things. Any takers? You will not win a prize, but any takers? Race? Okay. Yes. And race and gender. Correct. Another reframe, right? They think about recruiting, right? How are we going to recruit more people from underrepresented groups or historically excluded groups?

00:10:17:10 – 00:10:38:13

Or they think about unconscious bias training. How can we do one training that’s going to help inform some of this? What I would say is that’s a that is a pretty short sighted and incomplete way to think about diversity, equity and inclusion, because the reality is whether someone’s working at your organization or not, they’re having an experience with your organization the moment they go to your website and careers page, right?

00:10:39:01 – 00:11:05:14

Do I see myself in your story? Do I see that I can be successful in your organization? Is there a place for me at the organization? Do people look like me in positions of leadership? Am I going to be able to advance at the same levels as some of the colleagues who don’t look like me? Right? So when we think about diversity, equity and inclusion and what we do at the current collective, we try to help companies think about it across the entire employee journey before someone starts to your company, while they’re at your company.

00:11:05:14 – 00:11:20:12

And even once you leave, how many you know that people will tell the truth when they’re on the way out, right? So when you look at those exit interviews, survey data, what is it telling you about your organization? What is it telling you about what’s true? So again, we have to think about it across the entire employee journey.

00:11:20:14 – 00:11:42:01

And your employer value proposition is one of the key places to start. So ready for the five? Here are the five things that we’d like you to focus in on to challenge those assumptions, assumptions, and to get to the good stuff to make a difference. When it comes to equity and inclusion to transform your talent strategy. Number one.

00:11:42:01 – 00:12:10:13

On the next slide, your EVP must be updated for a 2022 World. Must be if you have not revisited your EVP since 2020. There comes a hyperbole. You don’t work at that company anymore. Now some of you are going to go. We have so many good things. Don’t don’t get you. We’ve been working so hard. We know. We know.

00:12:11:00 – 00:12:37:01

Of course you’ve been working so hard. Some of you have literally been working to keep people healthy and alive. So we’re not underestimating how hard your organization is working. What we are saying is you are not getting credit for the hard work that you have done to still be here and to have the people that are working with you and want to work with you to be here.

00:12:37:02 – 00:13:05:06

So you’ve got to go back to your employee value proposition, work with a large food and beverage company. I did name them earlier. I will not name them in this example who said to me two weeks ago, we really have to visit, revisit our EVP because we have new benefits, we have hybrid work. We have an expectation that the way we’re managing is different now, and it feels different and we know it’s not reflected in our EVP.

00:13:05:06 – 00:13:31:06

And I said, Good, now we don’t have to call you out when I present at the Conference Board. This is perfect if you are not revisiting your EVP. Employee value proposition. Sorry. If you have not revisited your employee value proposition since 2020, and I’m going to guess before your company has changed significantly and you’ve got to get credit for it.

00:13:31:08 – 00:13:55:14

Why? Because who you are needs to be represented to the employees that work there. A lot of times you’ve had to do benefits and employees have not paid attention. Now, I used to work internally at Pfizer Children’s Health Care of Atlanta and Deloitte internally at Deloitte. Not not, not not a consultant. And I’ve got to tell you, there’s you’re like, I’ve communicated this 15 times.

00:13:56:00 – 00:14:13:00

I know everybody knows about this benefit. And then you go on and you mention it in a meeting. Everybody’s like, I’ve never heard of that. Okay? So they don’t know because it’s not their job to connect the dots. It’s your job to connect the dots. And so keep reconnecting it for them. Make sure that they understand what you are doing to support them.

00:14:13:03 – 00:14:38:08

Also, make sure that they understand what’s available to them as they continue to grow within your environment. Your company is changed. Get credit for it so that you retain those employees and that you attract employees that want to be part of what you now have to offer. That value proposition that you now have to offer. If there’s one takeaway from me in my portion, please go back and look at your EVP.

00:14:38:10 – 00:15:04:12

If you don’t have an EVP, I’d love to talk to you, but you can do this on your own. You can do this on your own. You don’t need external help. Here’s what we’ve learned. You can see the takeaways here. Prepandemic EVP is not reflective of who you who you are. Now. An EVP needs to constantly evolve in fact, that may be a trigger for you for 2023 is how do we represent our EVP on a regular basis?

00:15:05:00 – 00:15:39:04

Again, employee value proposition. And people can see through this shallow perps of what your offering they can sniff. There’s this sniff test of like, okay, I love to call out to. I’m not sure that’s going to keep me here and I’m not belittling the comment. I think it’s wonderful. But there’s that sniff test of, I don’t know, there’s got to be more here and they want to be cared for.

00:15:39:04 – 00:16:01:11

Is an individuals and you do that often. They don’t know unless you go back and revisit the EVP. Second point. Second point is thinking about investing holistic and employee. Well, we hear this idea a lot. Bring your whole self to work. But what we have to understand is that means different things to different people, right? Depending on your identity, depending on how you show up in the world.

00:16:01:11 – 00:16:29:05

What does it mean for you to bring your whole self to work? And how are you as an organization and investing in the holistic well-being of your employees? A few things that we would call out here is you have to consider the whole person when designing, designing your approach to wellbeing. So for example, if you think about specifically various communities that have different needs when you think about your benefits because we’re just talking about benefits, are you thinking about things like your parental leave policy?

00:16:29:05 – 00:16:51:02

Are you thinking about things like gender affirming care? Are you thinking about things like equitable access to benefits for individuals who need that right? We’re designing for the modern world. So who is included and who is left out when you’re thinking about the well-being of your employees has to be top of mind. See, we have to understand that different identities experience the organization in different ways.

00:16:51:02 – 00:17:07:10

I remember when I was doing some consulting back in 2020, in the wake of the murder of George Floyd, I would show up into these meetings one of the few or one of the only black people in my company on a screen with people who don’t look like me. No one names the experience of what’s happening in the world at that time.

00:17:07:10 – 00:17:25:10

Why they’re afraid I’m going to say it wrong. I’m going to do it wrong. But here I am as an employee in the organization, like, do you care about my well-being? Do you see me when I come into this space? Right. And so when we think about investing in the holistic well-being, think about the things that are happening in the world, Are you naming them?

00:17:25:10 – 00:17:44:02

Are you creating space to acknowledge them? We’re not talking about the Pride Whopper, right? Like, did anyone see that? By the way, Burger King put out a Pride whopper? If you did that, we can talk about that later. I’m not going to say we try. We’re talking about real care for real people, not virtue signaling, not these things that are splashy campaigns.

00:17:44:02 – 00:18:01:11

We’re thinking about the well-being of employees. One of the things that’s interesting about Pride Month is a lot of these companies will put these slogans up, but they’re not actually supporting the LGBTQ folks in their company. So what does that signal to the people? It’s like, well, what’s true on the outside isn’t true on the inside, and that’s a problem.

00:18:01:12 – 00:18:23:10

So we have to think about the reality of how are we investing holistically in the unique needs of individuals within the organization. Investments need to be made upfront in your people. We think about how competitive the talent market is, right? And so how are you winning talent? One of the benefits I’ve seen lately that’s interesting to me is people are giving people two weeks off before they start at the company.

00:18:23:11 – 00:18:47:11

So you get a little reprieve to catch your breath before you go somewhere else. Right. Like, that’s interesting. What is that saying? I value your well-being. There’s a company recently won’t name any names. They said you have to come back into the office. Well, some people are like, I’m not working there anymore. Right. And so thinking about the ways that we have to prioritize, as Chris mentioned in the shifting world, invest in the holistic well-being of our employees.

00:18:47:12 – 00:19:21:07

Third one, your people. Leaders have to grow quickly. They must. They must. And what do I mean by that? I worked with many companies during the pandemic. All but two kept talking about, okay, when we go back and when it goes back to normal. Okay. And and there was this sense of let’s just get through this. And so they delayed dealing with the reality of where we are.

00:19:21:09 – 00:19:48:03

And now their people skills are mismatched with the challenges that they’re facing. Okay, I’m getting some head nuts. All right? I was like, are they going to feel good about this? Okay. Yeah. Okay. Do we have any professionals learning and development folks here? I’m your friend in this next statement, Okay? I’m your friend. It’s not Ellen. This job alone.

00:19:49:02 – 00:20:16:13

okay. I’d like to stand over on this side alone. It’s not their job alone, okay? This really does have to be owned as part of the business strategy and not sequester. Howard and Ellen, the work stream that then will pop up in two years and everybody else. I don’t know. Maybe we just put them through presentation training or courageous conversation.

00:20:16:14 – 00:20:42:04

We’re beyond that in some people. Again, hyperbole. Some leaders are in crisis mode because they don’t know how to manage out of this because they don’t have the skills to manage their people on a daily basis without destroying themselves or showing up for the people the way that they need to show up for their people. Why? Because we’ve never been through this before.

00:20:42:05 – 00:21:13:11

And until it becomes a business imperative to upskill people, managers rapidly, rapidly, like now, rapidly, we’re going to look at the curriculum development time that it normally takes to then launch training, then to roll it out. We may not be upskilling people. If we start today, we may not be upskilling people in some cases until spring of next year.

00:21:13:12 – 00:21:42:05

So it has to start today. That’s my second takeaway that I’d love for you to remember is your people. Leaders don’t have the skills they need to actually lead the organization as effectively as that they need to. So you’ve got to start it today and don’t put it all on L.A. shoulders. Let’s point. All right. So thinking about your culture, inclusive culture means both top down and bottom up.

00:21:42:05 – 00:22:10:14

And what we mean by this is we have to think about all levels of the organization. To Chris’s point about people, managers oftentimes moved into that position because they’re high performers, but maybe they haven’t been equipped to be people leaders. So that’s just a consideration that you have to have. When we think about top down and bottom up, one of the consistent trends we see whenever we go into organizations is the fact that the people who are employees experience organization way different than the people leaders or the executive leaders.

00:22:10:14 – 00:22:35:06

Right? So we go on these listening session tours and we create space to say like, how are you experiencing the organization? And it is often news to the executives like, wait, like you’re having some challenges that I’m not privy to or that I don’t experience in the same way. Why? Because as an executive there is a different experience that you have than someone who is on the front line or someone who works in a retail location, for example.

00:22:35:09 – 00:23:01:09

Right? So we have to think about the different aspects, who is in the organization and what does inclusion mean to them. There’s the shared experience, right? Like as an employee at the organization, you’re having a shared experience of being an employee at that company regardless of what position you are. So when we think about the idea that most people spend between 90000 to 100000 hours of their lives at work, probably exponentially increased in the pandemic, right?

00:23:01:10 – 00:23:27:10

Like, how are we creating a culture that is great for people, that supports their well-being and supports their needs? All leaders must understand how employees are experiencing the organization, and the management experience is often different than the employee experience. And then point number five when we think about your EVP and how you create a culture that is great for people, this idea of promises made must be capped.

00:23:27:11 – 00:23:51:04

One of the things that, if anything, 2020 did is it challenged organizations to get off the sideline and actually create a meaningful position or have a point of view as it relates to how are you showing up for historically excluded and marginalized groups and people want to know, are you living those values? If you look at some of these statements that were made, your company probably espoused something similar.

00:23:51:05 – 00:24:11:01

You probably articulated something. But how does it go from a promise to a platitude? Well, if there’s no action, then it’s a platitude. And people don’t trust that you are who you say you are. And we’re thinking about your EVP. We spoke to the data earlier. Candidates care a lot about what the experience is. Are you who you say you are?

00:24:11:01 – 00:24:31:10

Have you considered my unique identity? Right? Dr. Krystal Jones is the quote She says. She says There’s a big difference between the ideas. All are welcome here and this was created with you in mind. The latter of which is what we’re aspiring to within our organizations. How are you thinking about the promises you made? Are you keeping them to your people?

00:24:31:11 – 00:24:53:07

Are you inspiring trust within the organization that you are who you say you are? Over the past few years, we’ve seen a lot of organizations make promises, but where the rubber meets the road is in the action. Are you demonstrating this on a regular basis? Are you telling people what you’re doing and then being accountable for the things that you’re doing?

00:24:53:08 – 00:25:14:06

You need to ask yourself, are you who you say you want to be, who you said you are? Are you being who you want to be? And we think about these ideas as holding up a mirror to you and allowing you to reflect on what is true now and what is going to be true in the future. So those are the five not going to read them.

00:25:14:07 – 00:25:48:08

But let’s move to Q&A or questions you have for us. None right here. Yeah. we do have some good, good right here. Yeah, Yeah. So when you talk about investing, people manage your upskilling, right? What kind of suggestions you have outside of the traditional, as you mentioned, jokingly. Nice. Yeah. What else is out there? So empathy is a really easy one to go out.

00:25:48:09 – 00:26:15:05

And what I would ask you to do is do a needs assessment. I don’t know your organization. So it’d be malpractice for to set for me to say here’s an off the shelf type of recommendation, but Daniel might have some that he wants to recommend because I saw him looking at me like, What are you talking about? I got like, But I don’t know what your your company needs and so maybe that’s the challenge is to look at your organization with fresh, fresh eyes, finding that confirmation bias to go, we’re fine.

00:26:15:05 – 00:26:40:14

We got everything we need. And going, What is the gap here? Why are people leaving? Why are engagement scores stuck where they are? What is that telling us and how do we scale our people up? You have the data, you have it. I promise you have it. Your organization does about what the root causes. It’s about stopping and paying attention to what people are actually telling you.

00:26:41:02 – 00:26:59:06

And I say that with all humility. I know you are and your jobs are hard. Your jobs are very hard. So my recommendation is go and look at what people have told you and find where the gaps are. What do you want to add? Yeah, a couple of things. When you think about inclusive leadership, that’s a skill that can be taught, and part of that is recognizing unique identities.

00:26:59:06 – 00:27:16:03

So that could be an upskill. And then I also think about giving in receiving feedback as a consistent way because I think about growth specifically for employees. If you’re not getting feedback and we think about Gen Z, that’s something that’s especially important to that generation and millennials as well. I want to get feedback on my performance. How am I doing?

00:27:16:03 – 00:27:36:14

What does it mean for me to progress? And I think that’s a skill that can be taught, right? So those are a couple of practical things. And I would also say even for people managers to crisis point, how are they progressing through the organization as well? A lot of them inherit teams because they’ve been high performers, but like that isn’t the same as being educated on how to effectively lead an inclusively, lead a team.

00:27:37:02 – 00:28:06:05

So there’s a few thoughts. Other question. Yeah. So thank you for sharing your own personal story about George Floyd’s murder. Murder, Sure. In the room. So as a woman, I’m curious to hear your thoughts on Roe v Wade and the lack of conversation I’ll say about it with the C-suite executives. What are your thoughts on is there a line of what’s appropriate and not appropriate to lean into as a leader in an organization?

00:28:06:08 – 00:28:33:09

You’ll take that one. The first thing I’ll say is that it’s not prescriptive in my opinion. I’m not going to prescribe what’s good for everything or organization. But what I can say is I did see some organizations make a very overt and public statement and stance and even contribute to like if you need care specifically around reproductive rights, we will invest in that and help you relocate.

00:28:33:13 – 00:28:58:03

So what does that signal to the people in that organization that signals that, this is something that you’re considering, right. This is something that you care about. And so I think within any issue and specifically that one as well, I think there are spectrum of responses. What I will affirm are the people who took a very public and intentional stance to signal to their employees that we we know what’s happening in the world, We care about this.

00:28:58:03 – 00:29:19:09

And we’re willing to invest in it. So I think for me, like, again, I won’t go prescriptive and say that every company is like, that’s not my prerogative. I don’t think what I would say is how are you showing up for the people in your organization and how are you signaling the things that matter to you? Salesforce is one company that came out and made a very public statement and you talked about relocating people from Texas if they needed to.

00:29:19:09 – 00:29:43:07

So that would be look at the people who are inspirational and aspirational as it relates to taking a public stance. Ben and Jerry’s is one that I reference a lot too. They have on issues of race, inequity, gender, etc. like they have made very public and intentional stances on all of those things. And I celebrate companies like that that are willing to take a stand and put, put, draw a line in the sand, say this is what we’re about.

00:29:43:11 – 00:30:13:05

So for me, that signals a really positive thing. Hi. Hi. Hi. A two part question. The first part is when we talk about upskilling that’s needed. Could you possibly share maybe two or three of those key skills that you think are needed? 20, 22 and beyond? And then the second part of that question. Outside of L.A., how can this upskilling happen?

00:30:13:06 – 00:30:34:11

So you said it doesn’t just belong to L.A. Some examples. great. You want to talk about. Okay. Go first. I’ll take it back to you. All right. Let’s start with the second question. I would love and not to put everything on the CSIRO, but CSIRO to say we are seeing a gap in our organization. People are leaving because of X.

00:30:34:11 – 00:31:07:04

This is owned throughout the business. This isn’t just an issue, it’s actually a business issue because it’s it’s affecting who we have, who is leaving and who we’re bringing them. This is something that I want us to focus in on as an organization and that we prioritize this within our our business segment or within our view. That seems like something if they’re if you’re coming with data to say this is why people are leaving or here’s where the engagement score is, then we can have a conversation about data and cause and effect at it.

00:31:07:06 – 00:31:31:02

That’s how I would position it. I bet there are other ways to position it, but that’s the first thing that comes to mind when it when it comes to skills. For now and beyond. One of the things that we’re seeing throughout companies that we’re working with is a leaning into more agile ways of working.

00:31:31:03 – 00:32:06:02

Agile can sometimes be used as a stand in for we don’t know what the heck we’re doing and we don’t have a vision, but maybe we’ll find one. People get hurt in agile environments and people get helped and get inspired and create new things in agile environments. And so when I think about real agility and focusing in on scaling that up for the future, that is one where when you look at people getting left behind as business strategy is implement it.

00:32:06:04 – 00:32:33:12

Agile is a place to truly focus and make sure that people know how to lead to include. If you aren’t experiencing Agile in your organization, you will. It’s coming and in some of your like we dealt with that 20 years ago. I know, but it’s it’s still continuing to roll out and we’ve seen people inspired and moving forward and accelerating and some people get run over in the process.

00:32:33:12 – 00:32:54:14

Anything else come to mind? When I think about skill building, again, I’m just thinking about kind of modern workplace and the different identities. And one of the things that’s been interesting lately to research is intergenerational ideas. And so like, what are the different generations that are in the workplace? What are the needs of specific generations, and how can you, depending on the composition of your team, how can you show up for the different people?

00:32:55:02 – 00:33:13:06

I think about it more kind of in a nuanced and individualized way, right? Because you have a whole composition of different folks on your team. And so understanding what are these automatic buckets, whether it is intergenerational, whether it is identity specific, identity groups, how can you be better educated to engage some of the different people who are part of your team?

00:33:13:09 – 00:34:03:03

So that’s one of the things that I would highlight. All right, Chris and Daniel, thank you so much. That was really fantastic. We’re going to run right into.

Chris Thornton is a Senior Principal and member of the global leadership team at Daggerwing Group. In his role, Chris serves as a source of strategic counsel for Senior Executives with client firms, advising them on how to help clients achieve Executive alignment, transform their cultures and equip and enable people managers to lead and embed change. An expert in the people side of change with both client-side and consulting experience, Chris has worked with leading companies including Nestlé, Pfizer, and GE Aviation to do change right and make it stick. He is also an active speaker on business transformation, a driver of innovation in Daggerwing’s breadth of change consulting services, and the host of Daggerwing Group’s podcast, Change@Work. Chris and his wife were featured in the New York Times for their love of pie.
Daniel Oppong is the Founder of The Courage Collective, a Diversity, Equity and Inclusion Consultancy that takes a strategic, holistic and human centered approach to DEI work. He is also the Founder of Boundless, a platform designed to create access for underrepresented identity groups – specifically Black & Brown folks – pursuing career opportunities in Marketing, Consulting and Tech. His professional background includes work in Entrepreneurship, Venture Capital, Tech, Education, Consulting and the Nonprofit Sector. His academic background includes a Bachelor’s degree in Education, and Master's degree in Organizational Leadership.